2019-20 April 1

123 thoughts on “2019-20 April 1”

1. https://www.washingtonpost.com/outlook/2020/03/20/coronavirus-college-pass-fail/?outputType=amp

2. If you want to “[build] community during times of struggle,” then universal S/U is the only equitable solution to ensure all students are on an equal playing field. Stop valuing those who are more privileged by keeping opt in. There are things that are more important than a semester’s GPA, and a global pandemic where hundreds of thousands of people are projected to die and millions more affected is one of those things.

3. Despite the comments on this post leaning towards opt-in, from what I have seen through all of the Cornell student run pages on social media, the general consensus has been universal S/U. I think that reflects the will of the student body more so than this thread.

4. Mandatory S/U does not solve any of the problems at hand. You have heard from both the students in Big Red Pass and Big Red Choice. Either give us grades, or pass everyone. Mandatory S/U is not meeting us in the middle. Frankly it is a waste. If you are really concerned about students suffering difficult circumstances, what makes you think getting an S will even be achievable for them, if things are really bad. Making grades S/U is bad for everyone, and is not what any student, aside from the SA, has asked for. There is absolutely no point in doing S/U. Find a different, more effective way to take care of students who will face difficult circumstances. And allow students the choice to have letter grades. Many graduate schools are now saying they won’t discriminate against students who chose to do S/U over later grades.

   I think we need to propose a new solution that allows everyone to work for a grade, but provides a safety net and a guaranteed pass for those of us suffering from the CoVID-19 circumstances.

5. Support for universal S/U: A “choice-based” system is not a choice at all. It is similar to how “optional essays” for applications or “optional assignments” are not optional for students who want to do their best. We are all students who want to do our best. We will be incentivized to do our best, to work hard, and to learn something. If we want to be prepared for our future courses, we will try our hardest. But some people do not have the option to try their hardest because of the pandemic, and as a result, they cannot do well in their courses. With a choice-based system, they can either take a failing grade (and explain that they performed poorly because of the pandemic, which people can choose to listen to or not), or they can take something S/U, which is stigmatized against because then people assume you did poorly. Universal S/U is the closest we can get to calling this semester a huge anomaly for everyone and giving students/professors/everyone some kind of leeway.

6. The idea that a policy can be both “universal” and individually accommodating is not only contradictory but also erroneous. The most obvious problem with a universal pass grading system is that it fails to take into account the varying circumstances and academic stages our students are in. This is especially true for those applying to professional schools (namely dental, med, vet, etc.) where prerequisite courses CANNOT be taken for “pass.” How are students supposed to assume hundreds of professional programs will accept a “P” when there are other Universities that have not implemented such a policy.
   By giving students the CHOICE to choose their grading system, they will make the decision that best fits them at whichever academic and personal stage they are at.
   Forcing students to all adhere to a universal pass is simply placing Cornellians at a tremendous disadvantage, especially when it comes to future career planning and beyond. Let us not cause more stress and anxiety.

   Academics aside, if we do not have freedom of choice, what do we have?

7. The idea that any “universal” policy will be just on an individual basis is contradictory. The obvious problem with a universal pass is that it fails to take into account the needs of our students from their varying circumstances. Hence, the option to CHOOSE the grading policy that best fits your personal situation is the only plausible solution. So many of us are planning on graduate programs that require letter grade prerequisite courses. Who is to say every professional program will accept a “P” when there are other students (from other Universities) who chose the letter grade option during this semester? The adoption of a universal pass will only put Cornellians at a disadvantage, especially when it comes to planning their future careers.
   Academics aside, if we are stripped of our freedom of choice, what do we have?

8. We should be able to have a decision on how we would like to pursue OUR education. We should be able to choose if we rather a letter grade as opposed to it being decided for us.

   We are the ones receiving education at the end of the day; therefore, we should be able to choose how we want it to impact our grades/future.

   Please keep the option open for students to choose what classes they would like to be pass/fail.

9. What of students trying to attend graduate school who are in a poor home situation, and thus may be forced to choose between a poor letter grade and an S? Until there exists a guarantee that choosing the S won’t penalize students, universal S/U is clearly the option most equitable to this group.

10. As noted by the previous post, when classes come into effect, the faculty will likely become increasingly aware of many students’ inabilities to effectively do their work due to the state of the world/country today. This vote was taken by faculty likely residing in Ithaca, far from the epicenter of NYC where so many of us students are fearing for our parents’ safety and jobs. It was taken before students in these difficult situations have had the chance to turn our attention to school work. Those of us less focused on our GPAs at the moment and not in contact with the Senate due to more severe and pressing concerns have not been heard or, seemingly from the meeting transcript, hardly considered. I find it very disappointing that this resolution did not pass and feel that the university has failed to protect its undergraduates at this time, focusing instead on superficial factors such as GPA and preferring a policy of non-involvement, letting the blame fall on the students rather than the university.

11. I think it is unfair to assume everyone has a choice under the current system. Universal S/U is the only way to make things equitable.

12. If we want equality, universal S/U is the way to go! We live in uncertain times, and those who are currently advocating for choice in order to improve their GPAs are not looking at the big picture. What if, in two weeks, their circumstances change and they are left with no choice but to S/U all of their courses? Surely they would want a universal S/U at that current point. Furthermore, I have friends who live in areas with a poor internet connection. How will they manage to complete their work at the same capacity as those who have the privilege of living in a household with constant internet? I have friends whose parents are currently in the hospital suffering from COVID-19, and the last thing on their minds right now is their grades. They will ultimately have no choice but to S/U all of their courses. Why should they be penalized? I understand those who are trying to improve their GPAs in order to be more competitive for graduate school, but currently, we must show compassion to those living in less privilege. If you are doing well this semester, then go ask your professors for recommendation letters that say so. Explain in your applications that you are doing better, but due to unforeseeable circumstances you were unable to receive a letter grade. Your GPA is important, I understand that. However, now is the time to think of others, not yourself. I am doing well this semester, and I too was going to use this semester to boost my GPA. However, knowing that me improving my GPA is at the cost of those who are not afforded the choice to doesn’t seem worth it. It’s a difficult moment and I think it would be best to level the playing field and make S/U mandatory. Cornell is a bubble, and we are no longer in it. In order for things to be equitable, universal S/U is the way to ensure that everyone to an extent is on an equal level. When lives are at stake, GPAs do not matter, and we must support our peers during this difficult time.

    1. But we don’t want equality, we want equal opportunity. That’s the foundation of America and this University was founded on those principles. We need choice at all costs, if this freedom is curtailed, we are just hypocrites.

       1. We don’t have equal opportunity at this current time because we have stepped out of the Cornell bubble. Everyone is in different environments with different levels of access to resources and thus the only way to have equal opportunity is to have a universal S/U, not an opt-in grading policy that benefits only those with greater access to resources.

13. Not adopting a universal S/U grading system is an abysmally bad decision. The senate clearly does not have their own students in mind when acting in this manner.

14. I think in the middle of a global pandemic, it is important to follow in the steps of our peer institutions and do universal P/F. Since more and more peer institutions are implementing the universal S/U, graduate schools are less likely to be flexible and thus if we don’t mandate P/F or S/U, students who are already facing disadvantages this semester are going to be further penalized for being underprivileged. Cornell’s Any Person, Any Study implies equal opportunity which in this current situation we do not have.

15. Please for the love of god make P/F or S/U OPTIONAL.

    I need this semester for grad school prospects and most students at Cornell are considering grad school. I’m not taking orgo pass fail when I pay $70k a year.

    As for lower income students making everyone P/F does NOT help them. If you want to help everyone give us all As.

16. As a low-income student (I doubt many of the above are) who gets a full ride here… inequity is actually exacerbated from home and y’all who are low-income would actually know that. only the most privileged of us will get ahead under the chosen policy. Cornell literally is the epitome of collective egoism and individualism.

17. The final decision, if the University and Faculty Senate truly understand the circumstances of the students and the impact on them and VERY LIKELY NEGATIVE IMPACT on the next few weeks due to the increased projection of deaths, should be to have a Universal Pass/Fail or Universal pass. This is an extremely depressing time for the entire world, and for students that are mentally stressed and suffering from REAL problems and the very likely chance many students will BECOME mentally unprepared for classes due to the projections serves as a very legitimate and necessary reason to mandate all classes pass/fail or even universal pass. It is very sad to see it play out otherwise, as students have nothing in their control over what the world has thrown at them.

18. Some corrections and clarifications on the information on this site:
    Grading Options: Overview
    Option 1: Universal S/U
    Under “Arguments Against”
    – In voting for (16-7) a mandatory, universal S/U policy, the Student Assembly also recommended defining an “S” as being a D- or higher. This is in line with how Williams College, for example, defined an “S” as they switched to a mandatory S/U grading policy.
    – on the disadvantages to students: “it is unclear what requirements agencies and graduate schools will impose, though current conversations suggest that accommodations will be made to take into account the unprecedented situation presented by the pandemic and recession.” The medical schools of Harvard and Columbia have made it clear that they will accept “S” grades provided that they were received from schools that had implemented universal S/U (instead of opt-in) grading policies. More professional schools may be headed in that direction too thus making an opt-in system of S/U grades a “disadvantage” to students.

    On the Rationale for Maintaining a Choice-Based Grading System:
    A2. If, as the Student Assembly recommended, an “S” grade is equal to a D- or higher, then there is no disadvantage to students
    A3. The language has changed here from the overview where it says that a “mandatory S/U system may reduce the quality of feedback” to a “mandatory S/U system would reduce the quality of feedback.” This remains a point of speculation, not certainty.
    C. “Many of the nation’s most selective graduate and professional program admissions office have confirmed in public statements that they will not penalize S/U grades.” Here are statements from two such schools that highlight the advantage to students of a mandatory universal system of S/U:

    “The Office of the Committee on Admissions at Harvard Medical School recognizes that plans to complete pre-requisite coursework have been impacted immensely by schools’ decisions to move to an online instruction model given the current realities of the COVID-19 pandemic. While HMS has always assessed pre-requisites based on the grades given by colleges/universities, we understand that many colleges/universities are emergently creating policies in which all spring 2020 courses will be graded on a pass/fail scale. So that no applicants are disadvantaged by policy decisions made by their colleges/universities as a result of this unprecedented event, HMS will accept pass/fail grading for spring 2020 coursework provided it is the policy of the college/university to only award pass/fail grades.”

    https://meded.hms.harvard.edu/admissions-prerequisite-courses

    Spring 2020 Grading Update in Light of COVID-19 Impact on Premedical Education
    “The Admissions Committee at Columbia University Vagelos College of Physicians and Surgeons has voted to accept Pass/Fail grades for prerequisite courses taken at schools who have decided to go Pass/Fail for this semester. We understand some concerns about impact on GPAs and will take this fully into consideration for future applicants. For students in schools for which Pass/Fail is optional this semester, we will consider each student’s situation individually.”

    https://www.ps.columbia.edu/education/academic-programs/md-program/admissions/apply/application-requirements

    Penn Law’s decision to implement a mandatory Credit/Fail grading policy for this semester acknowledges the disadvantage of an opt-in S/U system:
    “According to [Penn Law Dean Ted] Ruger’s email, the school has spoken with a variety of employers in the legal field, and they uniformly understand that traditional grading is not appropriate at this time. Employers have also said that an optional Credit/Fail system would draw “negative inferences” from a student’s decision to receive credit over a grade.”
    https://www.thedp.com/article/2020/03/penn-law-credit-fail-coronavirus

    Many of our peer institutions have adopted mandatory universal S/U systems including MIT, Columbia, Harvard, Dartmouth, Williams, Barnard, Smith, Wellesley, Stanford, Bowdoin. Students at institutions with optional S/U grading policies would be a disadvantage in relation to their peers at the above institutions vis-a-vis admissions to professional programs such as those noted above.
    Amongst law schools, Cornell’s law school early on implemented a mandatory universal S/U system, as did other law schools such as Harvard, Berkeley, Michigan, Stanford, Penn, CUNY, and Wisconsin.
    In light of our current circumstances, the mandatory universal S/U system emerges as the more equitable and more advantageous grading system for Cornell students.

19. Please keep S/U optional as was already decided. Mandatory S/U would not be fair or equitable to all students. Mandatory S/U will have a negative impact on students who were counting on having the grades to raise their GPA this semester. My child had a bad first semester, not because she was partying, but because of persistent illness. She has worked tirelessly to get the grades necessary to raise her GPA. I am sure she is not the only one who finds themselves in this situation. Students who take the option of S/U will have the ability to explain their circumstances. It is highly doubtful that schools would hold that against them during a pandemic. If S/U becomes mandatory, students who have been working hard to improve their academic standing will be stuck with whatever their GPA was no matter how much time and effort they put into their courses this semester.

20. I hope every single faculty member who voted “no” is ashamed.

21. The New School, as well as certain other schools, have adapted the policy of universal A/A-. That would solve a lot of problems at Cornell in my honest opinion.

22. If you are more concerned about your GPA than the health of those around you, be better.

23. Why not make it pass/fail for the students whose GPAs were negatively impacted by this semester (so mandatory pass/fail) and give an option to those students who were able to boost their GPA this semester? That way, those students who were negatively impacted won’t face the stigma of ‘opting’ for S/U (as they were given no choice but to do S/U) and the students who performed well can still reap the benefits of their hard work. Is it possible to set a program in place that can sort students into these two categories?

    1. I think this is a great idea and was wondering if we could do something similar to this as well! Perhaps we could do this, along with giving some students the option to just choose S/U if they wanted to, so that it would be impossible to know whether a student chose S/U or if it was mandatory because of their grade. Or perhaps at the end of the semester, professors and the administration could look at how students grades have changed compared to how they were before we went to online learning. If the grades for any individual student decreased significantly after online learning was put in place, and would result in them doing significantly worse in the course, the professor could give this student a mandatory pass, as their worsened performance could be the result of the pandemic. Or perhaps come up with some way for students to report if they are experiencing circumstances that would make it unfair for them to receive a letter grade, and grant these students a mandatory pass for all (or any) of their classes.

24. Universal S/U is definitely the way to go because grades this semester do not mean the same as grades as other semesters. Everyone speaking in this comment section has access to the internet and has time to defend their views, but many Cornellians are currently fulfilling roles of caretakers to their siblings as their parents work in dangerous conditions, or living in areas of limited internet scrambling to figure out what they are going to do about in classes. Everyone in this comment section are healthy individuals, and it is extremely possible that some students are in the hospital fighting for their lives. This could change in two weeks. We are living in uncertain times and any one of us can be affected and the last thing I would think about when I’m getting treated is my grades. I think that since we are living in extremely uncertain times, it’s unfair to students who are really going through it to have opt in especially since some graduate schools are considering S/U grades only if it’s universal. Now is not the time to think about individual students but rather as a whole student body of 15,000 people all in diverse areas. Universal S/U helps those who can’t represent themselves here.

25. Please be aware that many students have no idea about the pending vote by the faculty senate, so their voices have not been heard. I only discovered last night and many of my friends had no idea either.

    It is hard for students to be subjected to the administration’s frequently changing policies—first the issue of the timing of in-person class suspension, now the issue of grading. This uncertainty causes students additional stress and anxiety. I understand that the administration is doing the best they can, but it is disruptive to keep changing the rules, especially without students’ knowledge or input.

    Here are a few points I would like to share with you:

    · “Mandatory S/U” will NOT provide enough of a benefit to the students experiencing difficult circumstances. While letter grades are not a good idea for students who are in extenuating circumstances, having students work for an S won’t be much easier. More flexibility should be introduced into the grading scheme in order to allow these students perform well.

    o How can students be expected to take classes for any sort of grade, even S/U, under any of the following circumstances?

    § Loss of family income due to COVID-19 layoff/closure

    § Student/family member is seriously ill

    § Death of family or friend

    § Lack of access to internet and other resources

    § Experiencing severe depression/anxiety/mental health issue

    o With S/U classes, a higher grade is needed to receive an S than is needed to pass a class.

    o If students are experiencing severe distress, S/U won’t make much more of a difference than receiving a letter grades. An S/U system will still generate stress.

    · Letter grades are crucial to Cornell students for a variety of reasons. Eliminating letter grades for a Mandatory S/U isn’t helping them either.

    o Eliminating letter grades negatively impacts the following:

    § Students striving to improve their GPA or meet certain GPA cut-offs

    § Transfer students, who have far fewer semesters to build their GPA

    § Students applying for grad school/internships/jobs/merit aid

    § Students trying to graduate with honors

    § Students needing to exert some control over their life

    § Student engagement in classes

    · Certain graduate schools are saying they will only accept Mandatory S/U grades. However, since this pandemic has yet to fully play out, it may be detrimental to choose Mandatory S/U solely on this basis. It is possible the graduate schools will change their tune on which grades they are accepting once the pandemic is over.

    · The possibility that this pandemic will resume in the fall makes choosing Mandatory S/U a bad idea. This would set a precedent that Mandatory S/U must be used again in the fall, or any other semester like this. Students who are going to Cornell will not pay good money for S/U grades, and retaining this grading scheme for multiple semesters would be academically detrimental for students.

    While reading the Virtual Senate Meeting website, I noticed that many people were mentioning that this decision has to have a fast turn-around, and must be voted on by today at noon. I disagree with this statement. Such an important decision, and one that affects so many students, should not be made this hastily. I implore you to take more time to deliberate this decision, and to give ALL students the chance to be a part of this conversation. The decisions you are making today are affecting all of us, and we should have some say in the matter.

    More creative solutions could be available, and Cornell students probably have lots of ideas about what to do. We do not necessarily have to copy the policies that other Ivy League institutions are developing.

    Thank you for reading this! I hope you take this into consideration, and realize that there are other creative ways out there to solve this problem! I’m sure the student body could come up with lots of ideas as well, if asked, and we would really appreciate the opportunity to have some say in the matter!

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